this sunday, the republican memo is out and the reaction is in. >> i think it's a disgrace what's happening in our country. a lot of people should be ashamed of themselves and much worse than that. >> the president's allies say the memo proves the entire russia investigation is illegitimate and this is just phase one. >> we are in the middle of what i call phase two of our investigation, which involves other departments, specifically the state department. >> democrats say the memo is nothing more than a smokescreen. >> this is just the latest chapter in an effort to distract attention from the russia probe and try to put the government on trial. plus, will president trump use the memo to fire the man in charge of the special counsel's investigation? rod rosenstein.

>> you'll figure that one out. >> this morning my two exclusive guests, president trump's first white house chief of staff, reince priebus, who knows how the president thinks and makes decisions. and former cia director john brennan on his concerns about the dangers of politicizing intelligence. and super bowl sunday, the nfl's big day. and it's big problems with concussions, politics and declining interest. joining me for insight and analysis are "washington post" columnist at nbc news political analyst eugene robinson, amy walter, hugh hewitt, host of the salem radio network, and yamiche alcindor, white house correspondent for "pbs sunday." welcome to "meet the press". >> this is "meet the press" with chuck todd.

>> good sunday morning to a lot of people. the headline of the republican memo was that it didn't live up to the hype, but that misses the point, the hype was the point. the pre-release campaign was aimed to discredit the russia investigation no matter what the memo did release. president trump tweeted, quote, this memo totally vindicates trump end probe, but does it? the memo does not make the case that the dossier by a british spy christopher steele was the reason the memo was opened. nor does this undermine what we know about the russia probe in the contacts between the trump family members and russian officials. he fired james comey because of this russia thing. in fact, white house counsel don mcgann who in his cover letter clearing this, to be clear, the memorandum reflects the judgments of its congressional authors. in other words, the white house

counsel is saying this is essentially a political opinion piece. still, many see president trump using the them mope as justification or an excuse to dismiss the man who oversees special counsel robert mueller's investigation, rod rosenstein. >> you figure that one out. >> reporter: president trump is not ruling out firing deputy attorney general rod rosenstein after the release of a republican memo who accuses senior law enforcement officials, including rosenstein, of abusing their surveillance powers to spy on former campaign aide carter page, who they suspected was a russian agent. >> i think it's a disgrace what is happening in our country. a lot of people should be ashamed of themselves and much worse than that. >> "the washington post" reports that mr. trump has told aides that releasing the memo might give him justification to fire rosenstein, who oversees mueller

and is the only person who could legally fire him. the white house is pushing back. >> we fully respect rod rosenstein to continue on as the attorney general. >> the memo has hyped by trump officials for weeks talks about the application for the initial surveillance warrant relied on by a dossier by christopher steele, a former british intelligence operative. >> four times they dressed this dossier up like legitimate intelligence not telling the court it was paid for by the clinton campaign. >> but democrats on the committee dispute that, saying the fbi did tell the court that steele's information was politically motivated. also, page had been on the fbi's radar since 2013 when russian spies tried to recruit him. and the memo undercuts its own case acknowledging it was not the steele dossier but trump campaign adviser george papadopoulos who triggered the

fbi counter intelligence investigation into russian influence in july 2016. now the campaign bin trump allies to push for the memo's release -- >> #releasethememo. call the number on your screen, call congress. >> has turned to robert mueller. >> the special counsel must be disbanded immediately. and by the way, nobody else will say this, all charges against paul manafort and general michael flynn need to be dropped, it's that simple. >> and house committee chair devin nunes says there's more to come. >> we are in phase two of the investigation involving other departments, the state department and some of the involvement they've had in this. >> joining me for the first interview since leaving the white house last year, reince priebus, former white house chief of staff.

"the washington post" reported last month the following, trump's ire at mueller rose to such a level that then white house strategist stephen bannon and then chief of staff reince priebus grew incredibly concerned that he was going to fire mueller and sought to enlist other -- white house counsel mueller said he would resign if this happened. what can you tell us? >> there are things that i can't get into, chuck, but i'll tell you this. which i think is something that i have talked to a couple people about. i never felt, of all the things that we went through in the west wing, i never felt that the president was going to fire the special counsel. so i never felt the level of -- >> it is possible the president

muttered the words, i want mueller gone, i want mueller fired. >> i never heard that. >> the sentiment was expressed? >> i think it was clear by the president's own words that he was concerned about the conflicts of interest that he felt that the special counsel had. and he made that very clear. perhaps someone interpreted that to mean something else. but i know the difference between fire that person and why isn't that person gone to what i read in "the new york times" piece. so i am telling you, i didn't feel that when i was there. >> did don mcgann express that concern? >> not in particular. but again -- >> is this story wrong? >> well, i think -- i didn't think it was right. put it that way. i didn't read that -- i didn't believe that it was accurate. >> but you're not ready to -- you're not disputing it entirely. >> i'm just telling you from my

point of view, because i never heard that. >> but it is possible he did express this? >> i think he expresses concerns with the conflicts, but i never heard the idea or the concept that this person needed to be fired. i never felt it was relaid to me that way either. and i would know the difference between a level ten situation as reported in that story and what was reality. to me, it wasn't reality. >> do you see a president preparing to fire robert mueller right now? >> no. >> you don't. >> not at all. >> this is all people -- >> i think it is news. i think it's a 24/7 obsession with this issue. listen, it's a legitimate issue that the president and all his supporters, the ones that go on television, reiterate they want to cooperate with special counsel. they're not going to get in the way. i've not heard anything to the contrary of that mantra.

>> you have spoken with mr. mueller and i'm not going to ask you what was said. >> which i cannot do. >> if the president asked you, should i do go before robert mueller, what would you tell him? >> i'll let his lawyers deal with that. there are certain things i just don't know. even though i was chief of staff, i want doesn't mean that i know every single thing that his lawyers are dealing with. i only know what i dealt with. and i can tell you, i never felt that there was some sort of collusion or some kind of obstruction situation going on in the west wing. i never felt that. and if there was ever anything at all that caused me any concern, i would go to the white house counsel's office and we would talk about it and get resolve. >> let me ask you another event in and around that time also, which was the report about the trump tower meeting between donald trump jr., members of the

campaign team at the time and the response to it, what the meeting was. here's what you said the meeting was the day after the report on "fox news sunday." hang on. >> it was a short meeting. it was a short meeting about a russian adoption. after 20 minutes the meeting ended and that was the end of it. i don't know much about it other than it seems to be on the end of the trump individuals of being nothing burger. >> you were not on air force one when that statement was dictated. we now learned the next day it was not about russian adoptions, we have the e-mails from donald trump jr. who told you the adoption story? >> that's what i have always heard. i heard that from members of the family, i heard that it was -- >> so when you were preparing to go on the show, you asked, what should i know about this meeting? members of the family told you russian adoption? >> that's all i ever heard it was about. in fact, i still believe what i said in that clip.

and that, in fact, it was a meeting about russian adoption in this thing called the majinsky act i had never heard of. but chuck, i was not there. >> did you feel misled reading the next day to find out that donald trump jr. thought the meeting was going to be about hillary clinton? >> no, not really, because i think in the end, the people involved, at least this is mys aeration, that the people involved truly believed it was a nothing meeting, totally about this, these issues of russian adoption. i don't know what the motivations were, okay? so up only know what i know. i wasn't on the plane, i was not involved in that meeting. >> do you know if the president was involved with the drafting of this or not? >> i do not. >> so if it was other people informing you of, this is what you should know about this meeting -- >> that's right. when you go on the sunday show

that morning, i think it was the only sunday show that morning that actually talked about that new york times article. >> and asked you about it. >> right. if you go back and look at every single sunday show, that was the only one that actually discussed it. but look, like all of this, chuck, and i can't get too much into it, and i have allowed some of this to go on to be fair with you, but i never felt that i was involved in something nefarious. the whole way through, from the beginning to the end. so you can understand the frustration of the president when he's told he's under investigation. i think you know the story of andrew mccabe that walked into my office, shut my door and basically told me that "the new york times" story that was in the paper, that first came out in february that said there are constant contacts between the trump campaign and the russians, with the door closed, looked at me and said, i want you to know that this story right here is

total b.s. it is overstated and it is not true. this is the deputy director of the fbi. i didn't know who he was, it's the middle of february. so everyone's in this world where we're being told one thing and sort of operating in this other world of constant obsession by the media. >> i understand. one more question about one more event, one more event that has been unclear, which is the michael flynn situation and the issue with sanctions. we now know a little bit more, you had said at the time, you know, you had asked mike flynn, he did not, he basically misled you and didn't tell you that his conversations with the russian ambassador were that. you were the recipient of e-mails from k.t. mcfarland and forwarded e-mails from tom bosser during the transition that did hint at a conversation flynn had. it's very possible you didn't read the e-mails, nobody knows. did you know -- when did you know that michael flynn did

speak to the russians about the sanctions issues? when did you find that out? >> well, i can't really get into all of that, because some of that is classified. what i can tell you is that there was never a time from the moment that this issue came up until the moment that we discovered that it wasn't necessarily true, there was never a time that michael flynn denied, in other words, every time michael flynn was confronted with the question of did you or did you not talk about sanctions, he denied it. and he denied it over and over and over again. >> there's one, in fact, the president's lawyer said the following, this is "the new york times," that mr. cobb said that mr. trump did not know that mr. flynn had discussed sanctions with mr. kislyak in the call. after the inauguration, flynn specifically denied it to the witnesses, were you one of the witnesses? >> well, i don't know -- i don't remember anything about in front

of the president, but i can tell you to me, certainly, it was something that he always denied, up until the end. and here's the thing, chuck, if general flynn would have simply said, wait a second, i actually did. or hey, hold on, maybe we did talk about this. or hey, don't you remember an e-mail that may have hinted? none of that happened. if it did happen, then it would have been, okay, is what you did right or wrong? okay, if it's wrong, what are we going to do about it? is it something we can correct -- >> you're saying you may have been willing to defend it had me been forthcoming? >> or say there was nothing wrong with it. we never got to that because there was always a denial. it didn't have to get to the point of 12 denials. i have talked about this before, which is why i'm comfortable talking about it with you right now. >> i want to ask you about the relationship you have with the president. >> you bet. >> because steve bannon shared this anecdote about you and candidate trump after the "access hollywood" tape.

>> oh, yes. >> and trump went around the room and asked what the percentage is. priebus said, you drop out right now or lose by the biggest landslide in american history. >> and trump had long questioned the depth of priebus' loyalty, the senior official described priebus' counsel that day as a "stain he was never going to remove. the starlet a.h.." i have heard this about the president and not just with you, he finds a moment that he didn't like advice and this is with any adviser and brings it up all the time. is this something he brought up to you? >> he brought it up occasionally. but he followed it up with the fact that the day and the next day i was the guy on the plane, playing both the moderator and hillary clinton preparing the president for the second debate. the other thing i would say is that no one in the room disagreed with what i was saying either. so it's one of those things

where -- people behind the scenes bring this issue up, but none of them spoke up and said, that's wrong. the truth of the matter is, i was making a point to the president on a serious issue. and that we had to do everything we could do to turn this campaign around, get ready for the second debate, apologize for what happened and move forward. and in fact that's exactly what he did. he turned the second debate around and went on a three-week, five-speech-a-day campaign and won the operation. if i didn't believe in the president, i wouldn't have transferred the millions of dollars put into his campaign and the field and data operation to boot. >> where did the condi rice/mike pence story generate? >> i don't know, it's not true. we said, this is the craziest thing we have ever heard of, it's not true. it's one of the fake news items, you could say. >> let me ask you about

immigration, the infamous autopsy report. the rnc in 2013 said the follow, we must embrace and champion comprehensive immigration reform. if we do not, our party ice appeal will continue to shrink to its core con stitch whech wt- constituencies only. do you think the president's making a mistake by not following your advice on this? >> i don't know about that. i think he's following the advice. i think if you look at what is happening on the economy, you look at tax cuts, unemployment, those things matter a lot. i think he is doing better. i think he did better with black voters and hispanic voters in the ex-will. i think we can do more. i don't think any in the autopsy is wrong. i think the president's position he's taken on the dreamers and daca is very bold. he's boxed the democrats in on that issue. i think it will be very difficult for them to walk away from. he's giving more than i would

have given in the same advice to him. but i also think it's clever of him to offer far more on daca than what most republicans would have offered because i think it boxes everyone else in. so i think it's very smart. >> all right. final question for you, paul ryan's a close friend of yours, speaker of the house, he won't say whether he's running for re-election. why? >> i think it's something he needs to talk to his wife about in the spring and make a decision, and i think it's what he's going to do. but i do think paul's view of what fundamentally is getting accomplished under president trump when you look at tax cuts, you look at isis, the courts, which is a historical record, when you look at regulation and what the president's done, you take away what -- you take away what the media wants to focus on, the decision-making process and some of the drama, but you look at what decisions are being made in the fundamentals, the

president's doing a remarkable job. >> so does ryan think he can retire, mission accomplished? >> my point is he's accomplishing the things he's worked on since he was 21 on. they're happening now under president trump. and as wild as that ride has been, both for paul ryan and people like myself, you cannot escape the fact that the president is doing a remarkable job on the fundamentals of what being a president is all about. >> reince priebus, thank you for coming on and for sharing your views. when i come back, we'll talk to the man who believes that ♪ (music plays throughout) ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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attacked the intelligence committee. on thursday, one day before the release of the republican memo, brennan sent out a tweet that said in part, i never witnessed the type of reckless partisan behavior i am now seeing from nunes and house republicans. absence of moral and ethical leadership in the white house is fueling this government crisis. joining us is john brennan who is making his debut as an nbc news senior national security and intelligence analyst. mr. brennan, welcome to nbc and welcome to "meet the press." >> thank you. >> let me start with the nunes memo. we know that the fbi is an agency that made the application to fisa that the cia was not involved, but you ran the interagency task force out of the cia beginning the summer of '16, included the fbi as concerns were rising about this russian interference. what can you say about what was -- what you believe the evidence that the fbi had to get that fisa warrant and how much of the steele dossier was a part of it? >> well, we, the cia and the

intelligence community had collected a fair amount of information in the summer of 2016 about the russians were doing on multiple fronts. we want to make sure that the fbi had full access to that. >> is the papadopoulos thing come through the cia, via the five is thing, how that works? >> i'm going to get into details about how it was acquired, but the fbi has a very close relationship with its british counterparts, so the fbi had visibility into a number of things going on involving some individuals who may have had some affiliation with the trump campaign. and so the intelligence that we collected was pulsed against that. i thought it would have been derelict if the fbi did not pull the threads, investigative threads on american persons who might have been involved with russia and working on their eit unwittingly. >> how much of this do you

believe is up winwittingly? >> i believe there was 98 i have day on the part of individuals on the trump campaign. individuals who were unaware of what their obligations were or how diabolical the russians can be. >> so the trump tower meeting, for instance, with donald trump jr., gets an e-mail he thinks it's hillary clinton dirt. if it's what i think it is, it's great. he takes this meeting with the russians. is that your -- you look at something like that, is that witting or unwitting in your mind? >> i fine it foolish and also irresponsible. senior members of a political campaign, presidential campaign, they need to be aware of what it is that they need to do in order to make sure they stay on the right side of the law as well as the right side of ethics. i find it inexplicable in terms of how that meeting took place and the interest in the part of the individuals very close to mr. trump who wanted to get dirt on hillary clinton from russians. >> when did you first learn of the so-called steele dossier and what christopher steele was doing? >> well, it was a -- not a very

well-kept secret among press circles for several months before it came out. it was in late summer of 2016 when there was some individuals from the various u.s. news outlets who asked me about my familiarity with it. i had heard just snippets about it. i did not know what was in there. i did not see it until later in that year, i think it was in december. but i was unaware of the providence of it as well as what was in it. and it did not play any role whatsoever in the intelligence community assessment that was done that was presented to then president obama and then president-elect trump. >> how was the steele dossier treated? how did you treat it? you said you looked at it in december. i assume it's been looked at -- it was obviously looked at by the fbi. we've now learned they have tried to confirm some of it and have had some success. some not yet. they don't say it's unconfirmed, but that's about it.

>> well, there were things in that dossier that made me wonder whether or not they were in fact accurate and true. and i do think it was up to the fbi to see whether or not they could verify any of it. i think jim comey has said that it contained salacious and unverified information. just because it was unverified didn't mean it wasn't true. if the russians were involved in something like that directed against individuals who are aspiring to the highest office in this land, there was an obligation on the part of the fbi to seek out the truth on it. >> i want to go to the central thesis of the nunes memo is that the fisa court was misled. misled about the origins of the steele dossier, misled about political bias. should -- we don't -- we are learning that the fisa court was certainly alerted of some political opponent being involved in this. how much detail should the fisa judge have known and should they have known more than they did? >> it's so hard to say because we don't have access to the underlying information of the nunes memo which really clearly

indicates that he was being exceptionally partisan in this. as i said in my tweet, i've had fights with the dems over the years when i was in the obama administration to include on the senate sweintelligence committe report on the cia interrogation program. but i never ever saw the democrats do something like this that was so partisan, so reckless and laid waste to the protocols that govern committees. devin nunes over the past several months, all the way back to the spring of last year, i think has been engaged in these tactics purely to defend, make excuses and try to protect mr. trump. >> you were pretty rough on the senate intel committee when they released the so-called torture report. compare the two. >> dianne feinstein and i had some very, very -- >> you went on this show and said some tough things on it. >> and i thought it was a partisan, one-sided report. yet, senator feinstein kept the republican members informed and did not decide to put something out that only reflected the

democratic side. the fact that devin nunes and republicans denied the ability of the minority, the democratic members of that committee to put out its report is just appalling and i think it really underscores just how partisan mr. nunes has been. he has abused the office of the chairmanship and i don't say that lightly. i think over the past year he has demonstrated he has engaged in these tactics purely to defend and make excuses -- >> has he brought up any legitimate issue in your mind in that memo? >> if there are issues related to the process involving fisa and if there are concerns about how forthcoming the bureau is, and i think the bureau from what i've been able to tell was very forthcoming. this was a renewal of fisa. he could have hearings. he could bring in the members of the fbi and others and to really seek what needs to be done differently, but he didn't do that. he just put out publicly one side and a very selective cherry picked memo. >> i want to get your reaction

to something your successor said about his decision-making process as head of the cia. here it is. >> government's worse than the private sector because incentive systems are misaligned. i led by example. 40% of the decisions that were previously made by the cia no longer are made by me. you might say, wow, that's reckless. i would tell you it was reckless to do it the other way. >> i think there are a number of senior members of this administration who follow donald trump's way of trying to denigrate and condemn everything that happened before them as a way to make them appear that they are doing things better than ever happened previously. and so i don't want to address what my successor says. i don't agree with some of the things that he has said, but i think it reflects a general insecurity that only if you criticize your predecessors, whether it be president obama,

or the former director of the cia, are you able to make points to try to trump up your credentials. >> republican opponents of you claimed you were politicizing the cia. there's some democratic opponents of mike pompeo that believe he's politicizing the cia. what do you hear from rank and file? >> i am so confident that the rank and file of the cia are going to continue to do their mission. they have been used to this before. this partisan sniping. unfortunately the rancor right now in washington between the democrats and republicans is at an unprecedented level. the ones i'm concerned about are the families of cia officers and fbi agents. they're the ones who sacrifice on the behalf of their loved ones. to hear people like mr. trump and others denigrate the work that they do and make distinctions between the rank and file and senior members, i think cia officers and fbi officers know that these are institutions that i believe have been well led over the years and that really are so important and critical to keep this nation safe and secure.

so i just am appalled by the things that are being said. >> john brennan, you're now had aing the title of nbc news national security analyst, senior national security analyst. welcome aboard. thanks for being on "meet the press." >> thank you, chuck. when we come back, will the memo convince americans that the russian investigation is tainted or that president trump's allies or that president trump's allies will do whatever it ronoh really?g's going on at schwab. thank you clients? well jd power did just rank them highest in investor satisfaction with full service brokerage firms... again. and online equity trades are only $4.95... i mean you can't have low cost and be full service. it's impossible. it's like having your cake and eating it too. ask your broker if they offer award-winning full service and low costs. how am i going to explain this? if you don't like their answer, ask again at schwab. schwab, a modern approach to wealth management. a heart transplant... that's a whole different ballgame. i was in shock. i am very proud of the development of drugs

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about the safety of robert mueller's job? >> i feel as confused as i think most americans do right now. i think it feels a little bit like, you know, when you're in the supermarket and there is music in the background, it's there, it's a constant noise but you can't quite make out the song exactly. i want to go back to something else and do a 30,000-foot view about where we are and how we got here. none of this what we're talking about right now would have been possible but for two things. one, the gradual disillusion of faith and trust in institutions that's been happening over the last 10, 15 years. some of it by their own behavior, whether it was the catholic church covering up sex abuse scandals, sports covering up doping, obviously 9/11 and the weapons of mass destruction. some of it is that people as part of the institutions, even politicians, things are rigged, things are corrupt, right? people start to believe that. and then so donald trump didn't invent this.

this has been part of it. and then the tribalism that we only will trust what comes out of the mouths and the opinions of people that we already identify with. so this is the culture that we live in. donald trump didn't invent it. he certainly is helping to stoke it and not heal it. but this is -- we are here at this point and it didn't come -- it's not accidental how we got here. >> yamiche, what has mattered more with this memo, what was in it for the president or the buildup. >> #releasethememo was way more important than the actual memo. when i was reading that memo i thought, okay, what was the big news here? what exactly am i reading? then when i read the cover page, it was all about public interest, it was all about this idea that they were trying to explain to the public that they needed to know this, that this was in the best -- their best interests, when in reality it was in the best interests of the president. the president saw this memo as kind of murkying the waters, and his tweets saying that this

vindicates him, when anybody who reads that memo realizes that that's not what's happening tells me that this memo was all about just getting the base to start talking about it. i've been talking to family members in miami who never really talk about politics. they're like what is this memo? i don't understand what is going on? what did the fbi do? that to me is the power of this memo. you have people now questioning the institutions without really understanding what everything is about. >> hugh? >> the memo proves -- i reviewed hundreds and hundreds of fisa applications for two attorneys general. i did that job for two years. the omission of a material fact is a big deal and that -- >> you don't know there's an omission of that material fact though, hugh. we don't know that. >> i believe it is fairly -- i will rely on the fact they did not say dnc/rnc, they said political. >> political opponent. >> they said political opponent. if i'm reviewing that and tell the attorney general, by the way, this came from the dnc and the hillary clinton campaign and that's not in the memo, we go back to the fbi, there was no

division of national security at that time, and we send it back and put it in. if you were a corporate executive in america and you did a quarterly earnings report that showed income from a source and you did not describe that source as sketchy, shady or suddenly compromised, you would go to jail. people ought to think about a fisa warrant as a quarterly report and hold it to the same standard. all that said, you and i talked on the radio. they oversold it. they should have put it out there without saying anything about it and they have hurt themselves as a result. rod rosenstein is not going to get fired, the special counsel is not going to get fired but this does hurt the fbi with the fisa courts. >> i think it's fascinating that the co-author of the memo and the man who saw the underlying intelligence, congressman trey gowdy, has been saying this does nothing to undermine his faith in the mueller investigation. and that of course there would be a mueller investigation, a

russia investigation without the dossier, without -- even without carter page, without the whole thing. so it is -- you know, this is -- we have seen the blowing of a lot of smoke this week. the smoke will dissipate. that memo -- the investigation is going to continue. >> bob mueller has spoken. the probe has not spoken, but when it has, it's gotten two lying to the fbi, two flips in michael flynn and papadopoulos. major indictment against manafort. you know, he's just doing his job and stuff is happening. >> because he has a lower profile, the attacks aren't on him personally. so when he goes to deliver the news, it's a lot different than when ken starr went to deliver the news because democrats had effectively undercut him and undercut his credibility and made it about ken starr personally. >> isn't that what this is? >> this is undercutting the

underlying evidence that's going to robert mueller. but he as a messenger is more credible than, say, somebody coming out of another institution. >> if you listen to the trump supporters, though, and people who are really in his camp, they're going after mueller. they're saying his name. it's republicans going after republicans and republicans going after institutions that usually were conservative. so you have this weird situation where i thought it was really important that john brennan was saying that, yes, i had issues with democrats but they never did what this administration is doing and these people are doing which is really -- >> i have to disagree, yamiche. i talk to mcconnell, ryan, no one is calling for mueller to be fired. no one is calling for rosenstein to be fired. maybe he might have to recuse on an obstruction case because he authored the memo about comey. i don't know a single republican of stature in the party who wants mueller fired. >> to yamiche's point, though, it is fascinating that you see people on the left of the democratic party saying how dare

anyone attack the fbi. >> i'm old enough to remember, right, gene? >> and people on the right on the republican party, virtually the entire republican party saying the fbi violating our civil liberties. >> by the way, let me put up the quick phone number to support your point. among republicans, republican favor ability in the fbi in negative territory. >> and it's gone up among democrats. >> it's astounding to me. >> and sarah sanders said from the podium of course he's not going to fire for mueller's firing, we can imagine that you in the press would do. paul ryan and mitch mcconnell know that people would go after them so they're being smarter than just saying that. >> i want to button up something from reince priebus . he kept saying i felt. >> he cannot be per injure jure. he's obviously feeling like he's not a target and in the clear.

>> when you heard the word "felt" that's legal advice? >> yes. >> all you have picked up on that and i wanted the audience to hear your guys' reaction on that. when we come out of this, we're going to talk super bowl sunday a little bit and why some people say they're not following people say they're not following the nfl as closely as they mom? dad? hi! people say they're not following the nfl as closely as they i had a very minor fender bender tonight in an unreasonably narrow fast food drive thru lane. but what a powerful life lesson. and don't worry i have everything handled. i already spoke to our allstate agent, and i know that we have accident forgiveness. which is so smart on your guy's part. like fact that they'll just... forgive you... four weeks without the car. okay, yup. good night. with accident forgiveness your rates won't go up just because of an accident. switching to allstate is worth it. money managers are pretty much the same. all but while some push high commission investment products, fisher investments avoids them. some advisers have hidden and layered fees.

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difference. this year, only 49% say they follow closely while a slim majority, 51%, now say they don't. that's a minus 2 overall for football and an 18-point swing in interest isn't just four years. so what's driving this? well, one clue could be in who's driving this. whites have seen a 12-point drop among those who say they follow football closely while blacks and hispanics have essentially held steady. and when you dig deeper, it's white men behind this drop, a 22-point slip from white men while white women are unchanged. in a politically divided country this change in attitude looks strangely bipartisan. the drop has been steeper among republicans, 15 points, but democrats and independents have declined as well. studies have shown there are a lot of reasons behind all of this, but two do stand out. player protests are clearly turning off some fans as well as the safety concerns of the game, both for the game that we watch and how we watch it and the game our kids play.

parents who have a child at home were asked if they'd encourage them to play another sport due to concern about concussions. the percent of those who said yes was up nine points between 2014 and 2018. among just dads up it's six points. among moms, a 13-point increase in those who would encourage their kid to not play football due to the safety issue. to be sure, the nfl still rules the roost of american sports. over 100 million people will tune in tonight, some for the game, some for the commercials, and some, of course, for justin timberlake. but the real question for the nfl will be how many tune in on sundays next fall? when we come back, end game and tonight's big game. we'll go deeper into how the political culture wars have impacted the way people feel about the nfl and the role president trump has played in that. coming up, end game and postgame, brought to you by boeing. continuing this is something that i'm

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end game, brought to you by boeing, continuing our mission to connect, protect, explore and inspire. the reverence for those who have served our nation reminds us of why we salute our flag and why we proudly stand for the national anthem. >> back now with end game. that remark during the state of the union address this week about standing for the national anthem was just president trump's latest swipe at the nfl, though a little more subtle than when he was in alabama last year. the president has been highly critical of players who have refused to stand for the star-spangled banner and mr. trump has credited himself for this year's slipping nfl tv ratings. joining our panel right now from jupiter, florida, on this super bowl sunday is a man who knows a thing or two about both football and politics, it's bryant gumbel.

bryant, good to see you. >> good morning. how are you doing, pal? >> i'm all right. let me ask you this. you had a pretty powerful monologue after the president's initial comments when he made those remarks in alabama about what owners ought to do to players. how does the president's insertion of politics into football, how has it impacted the game in your opinion? >> well, i don't think you can totally ignore it, but i'd like to believe that at this point people of good will recognize the protest is about police brutality and has nothing to do with the military or the flag. so, yeah, has it had some effect on the lessening of interest in the nfl game? i think that's part of it, but i think it's a very small part of it. i think there's some bigger issues at work. i think number one is, i think it was malcolm gladwell said it's going to be in 25 years socially unacceptable to be a football fan. the concussion problem is an issue. oversaturation is an issue. i think television is down in all shows across the board,

morning shows and television news shows. and i think the one that's being overlooked is the nfl product is not a very good entertainment product anymore. it's become a very uptight corporate league and a dink and dunk league and people aren't as drawn to it as they used to be. >> bryant, hugh hewitt. how much of the nfl's problems is really the flip side of the college game's ascendancy. i'm a bucs fan and a browns fan. how much is it that college got their act together? >> hugh, i think you're right. i heard you talking earlier about tribalism. that evidences itself on the football scene, as you know all too well. folks in alabama aren't interested in watching ucla/usc but they will watch alabama and auburn. same for folks in louisiana, texas, et cetera. and so i think that is part of it too, that the college game is growing. the college game is not as much of a copycat league, it's not as much of a corporate league, it's not a stop-and-go league where you have to turn to instant replay every other second. i think it's a more attractive

product. you also have the dimminiton of the audience of nfl used to be sacrosanct. now you can get it on sunday night, thursday night, monday night. >> gene robinson. how much does viewership have to do with specific stars and specific teams. the cowboys, who were supposed to be good this year, who were america's team in fact, were pretty awful. no incentive for all those fans to watch. aaron rodgers, best quarterback in the game, went down -- sorry, chuck -- >> was injured. and again no incentive for all those green bay fans to watch. do you think that's a factor or is that not important? >> you know what, gene, i don't think it's as big a factor as it is in baseball where you need one of the big teams, you need the yankees or the dodgers or the cubs to be engaged for the nation to be engaged. but i do think if you ask the owners, they would say, yeah, people tune in to see the duel

between brady and rodgers. they tune in to see manning go against someone else. the idea of tuning in to watch second-string quarterbacks go tat it does not move the needle very much. they have always sold teams more than they have sold individuals so i'm not sure it's that big a factor. >> yamiche. >> talk to me a little bit about how the social impact of president trump talking has really impacted how athletes feel the pressure to speak up. i think about athletes like kareem abdul-jabbar of there was a moment there where he is now very active. you think of muhammed ali feeling the need because he's an african-american man to speak up. do players playing now feel pressure to speak up? do you think they want to speak up because of what's going on or do you think they would naturally already be doing this? >> that's a great question. i do think that when the president weighed in, it energized african-american athletes to an extent unified them in a way they had not been before. just how much pressure they feel

i think depends on their position on the team and the team they play for, the owner's stance. there are some owners who are more willing to allow the players a great deal of freedom of expression and there were other players who aren't. let's face it, if you are a star or if you are an indispensable member of a team, you have more latitude than the guy who's just barely hanging on for the job minimum. >> bryant, you interviewed mike ditka. i'm not going to play the clip because i'm low on time here, a couple years ago. and we were all stunned when mike ditka said he wouldn't have his kid play football. and he was almost in tears telling you this. but he just thinks the reward isn't great enough anymore. >> yeah, a little bit of context. he was coming off of talking about a teammate of his, mike pyle, who was the center of the bears teams that he was a part of and he was in a bed seriously ill, with most of his problems relating to his years in football. i don't think what he expressed is unusual. just this past week didn't we

hear justin timberlake say the same thing. >> i guess i expect it more from justin timberlake than mike ditka, you know. >> yeah, i understand that, you're right. iron mike, you would think he'd love football until the day he died and i think he still does love it. but our eyes have been opened to the dangers of the game. the reality is it's not a game that's going to leave you healthy and of sound mind. >> bryant, on that note i wish i could say we are going to end on an upbeat note. it's still super bowl and we're going to have a good time. bryant gumbel, thank you, sir. >> i hope so. thanks, chuck. >> that's all we've got for today. thanks for watching. get the pizza, the wings and at our party we're going to have po' boys too. we'll we back next week, because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." >> announcer: you can see more end game and postgame sponsored by boeing on the "meet the press" facebook page.

wow, the world cha wow. we're world champions! [ cheers ] >> fly, eagles, fly. the philadelphia eagles toppled the new england patriots in their first super bowl championship in history. and fans in philly take to the streets to rejoice. we'll have the highlights. deadly crash. two people are dead and over 100 injured after what is now the second amtrak train crash in a week. what can be done to prevent another one? plus, a republican memo on the russia investigation makes waves in washington as new details come out on a former trump aide at the center of it all. lady gaga delivers bad news to fans around the world. and brave runners shed their clothes for the race o